Sacred White Buffalo
Couple very similar questions for the CPO (Please wait until the CPO answers before making comment on this.)
If a landowner owns land (assume a perfect square 40 acres with 1 vehicle entrance bordered by 3 neighbors and 1 public hunting area). 2 of the neighbors have decided to lease or let others not familiar to the area hunt their land. Also the land is gated at the vehicle entrance with no trespassing sign along with property line signs no trespassing and property line markers. The following is in the event the landowner wants to prosecute them to the extent of the law.
1. If at sun up a hunter is in a tree next to the landowner on this private property without permission what can be done and what will be the outcome?
A. Can I keep them at bay in the tree?
B. Can I photograph them?
C. Should I call the Police or CPO?
D. What information do I need from them? (They are noncomplaint to police so why will they tell me anything? If I dont know them then how am I gonna find out who they are if they leave?)
2. If Trail cameras photograph hunters on this posted property what can be done?
3. I see that IDNR law states permission required but Illinois law states it slightly different. Are they the same and how are the fines/penalties different?
4. If the trespassor does not have a weapon with them is this now outside Illinois CPO and becomes Criminal Trespass?
5. Many times I see postings in the local newspaper ( I remember by some laws - - Divorce, Death, Bankruptcy, change of name --that it must be posted in a paper X number of times to insure all is aware even if they do not get the paper) so does posting in a local paper become legal status for compliance to telling others that permission is not granted for enter of land?
6. What can be done about the ones coming from Public Land. This is a problem as they feel every woods touching the Public land is OK to hunt. There are property lines and I have tried to get the check in station to give them a map. Right now State property signs tell us to stay out next to the private property signs tell public hunters they are trespassing.
Please help. I have young hunters and want to make sure they are not shot by a trespassor. Signs don't seem to phase them.
I appreciate your time. Just getting frustrated.
Last edited by Debunk; 11-12-2009 at 16:49.
“Give a man a fish and he has food for a day; teach him how to fish and you can get rid of him for the entire weekend.” –Zenna Schaffer
Well, you have obviously thought this through!
First--contact your Region office (phone #'s on page 1 of the Hunting digest) and leave a brief message with your name and contact # regarding the problems and that you would like to speak with your local CPO about it. This will resolve alot of your potential problems by letting the CPO know about it/ handle the problems and figure out where your property is located.
The hunter has essentially committed 2 violations: the first is 520 ILCS 5/2.33(t)--"hunting without permission". No signs or fences are required--the hunter/fisher/trapper etc is required to know where they are and to have permission. That's about all you really need to know--the game warden will know the most appropriate section to cite, based on the individual sections of Conservation Code which cover fishing/trapping/root digging etc. The second violation is criminal trespass to real property. 720 ILCS 5/21-3 (2) ---because you posted the main entrance. (ILCS means Illinois Compiled Statutes)
Usually the first section is much more appropriate for outdoor/hunting situations, but we have written both sections to persistent or blatant individuals.
Part A--As far as detaining or restraining them, see 725 ILCS 5/107-3, Arrest by a private person---- which states "Any person may arrest another when he has reasonable grounds to believe that an offense other than an ordinance violation is being committed."
Ordinance violations are city "laws", and it basically says these don't count.
520 ILCS Conservation Code and 720 ILCS Criminal Code (both mentioned above) are State laws and would apply to the situation you mention. As far as what arrest means, see 725 ILCS 5/107-5 (a)--...."actual restraint of the person or by his submission to custody."
I would suggest trying to be discreet (or sneaky) and definitely immediately calling from a cell phone while keeping an eye on the subject--its possible they won't think much of another hunter (you), and keep hunting long enough for the game warden to arrive.
Question 1-B and C--absolutely, great idea, photograph and definitely call a CPO or Police officer-- the hunting-related stuff is our line of work, but a regular Officer can still handle it if necessary.
Question 1 D--full name, address, and possibly phone number and birthdate--if they will show you a picture id, all the better---However, I don't suggest pushing this issue if it will get physical, usually it will be better to wait for a CPO to get there. License plates and boat registration helps too. (photos work great for those as well.)
Question 2--see the first paragraph I typed--contact your local CPO with the info
Question 3--I think you misinterpret "DNR law" and State law- It's all State law--I think I may have answered this in Question 1--The difference between the Conservation Code and Criminal Code is that Conservation is related to hunting,fishing, natural resource related violations and Criminal is related to criminal violations, although sometimes a single act can fit either code. Under Conservation Code, it is a Class B misdemeanor and the fine can be up to $1500. and they can lose hunting gear and possibly also receive a "Civil Penalty" (in addition to the fine) for the value of any wildlife they killed. Criminal Code typically consists of a fine (I'm not sure of the maximum amount) and they have the added bonus of the criminal charge which always looks bad on anyone's record. Community service can also always be added to either one of these.
Possibly, but not necessarily, it could be a criminal trespass circumstance, but if you suspect it is related to hunting/fishing/trapping/root digging/logging or any other natural resource related activity, you should still definitely call a CPO. (If it turns out to be something else, we still have the authority to make the arrest--we can enforce all the laws of the state.) If its just someone that is looking for a place to party or booze it up, then call the sheriff.
720 ILCS 5/21-3(b) covers some of what it means to be notified, but doesn't mention newspaper postings--I have heard that this qualifies, (and I've seen it in papers), but I don't know for a fact. I would suggest checking with the states attorney for the county you are in to see if it applies and if he can tell you the section number of the law so you can read it for yourself.
Same issue, ---contact your CPO. They are still trespassing/hunting without permission and are required to know where they are and to have the appropriate permission. Once you get your local CPO in there to make some arrests, things should settle down pretty quickly. We are not private security guards so to speak, in the sense we don't have the manpower to necessarily patrol numerous private lands to catch trespassers, in addition to enforcing everything else that we have, but if you have a persistent problem, which it sounds like you do, we are able to make exceptions if our schedules permit it. We'll definitely come if you find someone on the property and call.
I hope this helps clear it up for you, don't get too frustrated, get to know your local game warden.
By the way, Kudo's to you for taking kids hunting--we need more of that!